Curing the gays
We’ve been getting a few emails concerned about Conservative candidate Philippa Stroud and her religious inclination to ‘cure’ those who prefer a bit of healthy man-on-man, or gal-on-gal action to the other mixed-sex variants once popular in the nineties. A Guardian article outlining the story is here.
I’m not interested in politics, and don’t wish to comment on this as a political issue. I have, however, attended these sorts of church sessions and even courses which set about healing the ‘brokenness’ of homosexuality. Their premise is that we should be straight, as intended by God, but that when our early relationships with same-sex parents are unfulfilled, we develop an unmet need for identification and closeness from our same sex which is then eroticised during adolescence. Make of that what you will: certainly it’s not uncommon for us whoopsies to have struggled a bit with parents of our gender, but whether that’s a cause of sexuality, or a result of it, or not at all related, is a different issue. Offering counselling, holding courses, and authoring various books on the subject are a number of people once gay, but claiming to have turned straight through the Grace of God, and through healing those broken relationships. When these people are questioned closely, they do not so much as talk about a full ‘conversion’ of sexuality, more that they have learnt to not respond to their homosexual urge (and which they still acknowledge from time to time) and that they have found a place in their lives for a straight relationship. Again, make of that what you will. Certainly it seems to me that if you’re offering the promise of change to people who may (for whatever reason) desperately want it, it’s important to come up with the goods. I don’t believe that it does really come up with the goods, which will come as no suprise, I’m sure. So a word of warning to anyone unhappy in their sexuality who is considering this route. It’s more likely to cause further depression than stop it.
At the time I was fascinated by its claims, and like many people wishing their sexuality would pass or change, hoping it would be effective. Looking back on it, it is of course simply misguided and damaging. A good friend of mine was very active in the movement for years, eventually realised he was not changing, and is now very happy in a gay relationship, having dealt with the ‘guilt and embarrassment’ of ‘failing’, as it inevitably seemed to him. For all that, he has become a firmer Christian, so I wouldn’t presume to say that he regrets his experience of it all. Faith is a funny thing.
I share the distaste that many feel for this. Regardless of how ridiculous (and offensive, if you take offense at such things) it may sound to ‘cure’ gay people, there are plenty of unhappy people – especially, I would imagine, those holding a religious belief – who would welcome the idea of an easy change to being straight. It would be lovely to think that a church at least in part devoted to peace on earth and making people happier would turn their efforts towards the far more helpful cause of educating people to accept (through whatever complex play of nature and/or nurture) how they or others have turned out in life. I’m sure plenty of Christians – even Tories – find such ‘therapy’ quite distasteful, however confusedly well-meaning it might be within the world of the gross religious presumptions it inhabits. I hope that both groups have the sense to publicly distance themselves from this confused and probably quite harmful practice. I read of such things now and shiver.
D
Well put. Timely, considered and honest.
well said DB! I too was an avid happy clappy church goer in my youth, much to my parents dismay. I came out to my youth leader, and told him that I thought I was gay/bisexual. The response that he gave me was as follows “If you are having those feelings, you haven’t got Jesus in the centre of your life”. I felt that this was probably the harshest thing to say. So not only was I struggling with my sexuality, I was now also a useless Christian. However I did get some amazing support from some other members of the Church. Alas the majority of us and them left, and ended up being called Pirates and Mercenaries of the Devil by congregation members who would previously sit with us and enjoy civil conversation. Needless to say, I am not longer a devotee of the Big Man Upstairs…
I can’t remember when I for the first time heard about homosexuality. I think it was my cousin who I was told had moved in with her girlfriend. I was young at that time, but can’t remember much interesting thoughts about this inside of me. More than ..oh .. it wasn’t. Later in life it sort of got me a bit interested in whether there was a difference between heterosexual relationships and homosexual relationships. I ran into gay couples and decided that there, in the end, was not really a difference.
It must be difficult being gay and not wanting to be gay, that bad that you want to be cured from it. I would still wonder .. is that due to their own self or due to society. Is it being straight in a gay body? The ancient question then pops up .. what is it that makes us hetero, or gay?
Good one Derren for posting this! more people need to know about this madness. x
I admire honesty and wittiness shown in this article.
I hate the picture though.
An excellent response to a distasteful point of view. This sort of idea does not help anyone. All it does it put people through unnecessary anguish over something that is irrelevant to one’s worth in the world.
I hope God will save us from the Tories 🙁
Maybe the sexy Devil helped Dr Caroline Lucas win a seat for Brighton. Go Greens!
Having read Doug’s post, I feel obliged to poke fun…
Maybe we could encourage Derren to donate some manjuice to a lab along with some of the other great mentalists and magicians of our time. Teller? Paul Daniels? (only joking about PD, but I did love him as a kid. Milk in head and out of ear? Classic) Blaine and Copperfield? Nah. Mr Nyman? Maybe.
We could create a breed of supermentalists, Like Berber-Anna said.
They could form a parliament- every legislative decision we have a referendum, and then they pull their predictions out of a sealed envelope.
The media and govt. already use NLP techniques to influence our behaviour, what difference would it make to be professionally manipulated by lab-created superbeings?
Isn’t it interesting that when religion gets involved in a discussion, suddenly everyone has something to say?
I hasten to add that have nothing against religion in general, it’s simply the patronising attitude of the minority who feel that homosexuality is something that needs to be “cured.”
I’m sure that there are a lot of people out there that are confused and concerned about their sexuality, even in these more tolerant times. What irks me is when vulnerable folks are preyed upon by those offering a quick fix for their own dubious ends. Much like the so-called psychics offering solace to the bereaved in exchange for cash, this minority of religious extremists target a group of people looking for help and re-assurance and reinforce an outdated, negative and damaging belief system.
Kenn
My initial reaction to hearing about these groups was to be angry – then thinking about it to be simply very sad for the people they were abusing, and the circular nature of that abuse. To desperately want to change a facet of yourself is something that almost anyone can understand, but when that internal desire is supported by a framework, when someone is telling you that you are inherently damaged in your expression of who you are, feeding into the worst that you feel and telling you that you are right to be ashamed, that must be very horrible and profoundly hurtful, then to bury those feelings and perpetuate this kind of ‘treatment’, possibly with the best of intentions… anger may be a little misplaced, and perhaps we would be right to ‘read of such things now and shiver.’
Ahh. ‘Bless em’. When one life just simply isn’t enough… Investing in post-life pension plans for everyone else, selflessly eschewing consent and even the flimsiest of basic logic. But all that work for a puritanical afterparty? Virgins? Daylight? – Not inspired by your VIP section, I must be honest. Think I’ll be down in the basement on a podium.
Surely an impulse or choice can only become “an urge” when you repress it. “Oooh… but I mustn’t! But oh how I want it so!” – Isn’t this a prerequisite for addiction, compulsion, obsession? Otherwise it’s just something you like… no big stakes involved so no stress and compulsionmaking dilemma involved in choosing a thing you like… yes, no?
My invisible friend is bigger than your invisible friend, and his Dad’ll have you ; -)
Rob: I think we’re missing half the equation here. Where’s the brood mares? Should we go for sexy magician’s assistants (hey, our new rulers had better look a bit nicer than the old ones), or should we try to find some wicked magiciennes? Not a lot of those around, though, unfortunately. Maybe some fake psychics, for manipulative powers?
yes! us magician’s assistants are HOT! 😉
Its no good moaning about gays, it dates back to before humans were evolved, back to the dinosaurs in fact.
The gay male dinosaur was called a MEGASAWARSE and female ones were LICKTAPUSSES. i’m sure if they were alive today no one would argue with them.
Except Jesus who said they never exsisted.
Sutton & Cheam, have restored my faith humanity by rejecting Philippa Stroud and her form of extremist evangelical Christianity.
This was not a fight of yellow, blue and red in my eyes. It was a fight to keep out those who would enslave us under their religious dogma out of positions of power.
I did not publicise this to deny the Tory party a seat as some might believe. I Spoke out and told my story because the electorate of Sutton & Cheam deserved to know the full nature of Strouds beliefs and not just the nice side of her faith without its ugly side also exposed.
I believe the people of Sutton & Cheam have helped me bring some closure of this period of my life and I feel they have achieved some justice for me I thought I would never get.
Regards
Abi (from the Observer article)
Derren…. this week’s episode of ‘House’ deals with the subject of a gay man who goes to a ‘conversion’ camp to make him ‘straight’. Naturally, it doesn’t work lol….but it’s very good nonetheless.xx
@Abi Good for you! (I am sure you have helped others too!)
A perso called ‘Line’ mentioned that Jesus said a lot about homosexuality and left readers to consider a ‘.’.
My understanding of what this person suggests is that Jesus perhaps had no problem, being Jewish and under the Mosaic Law before his death, with homosexuality – a practice his God had clearly condemned in the Law. Also, Jesus makes reference to Adam and Eve and how God yoked man and woman together. He, Jesus, also mentioned that the only grounds for divorce was fornication, Greek:Porneia, which includes all immoral intercourse outside of marriage between a man and woman only. And lets leave out the ‘he who is without sin’ argument as any Bible Student knows this portion of scripture is spurious.
People, part of the fruitage of the Holy Spirit is Self-control…
How can anyone believe in a book written 2000 years ago, espesially one that that’s been edited to suit all the various beliefs down the ages? At the end of the day there is only black and white and everything inbetween. Which is where I like to be.
Steven, of course everyone is free to believe in a God who ‘yokes people together’, but personally, I’m no ox. I also think your God’s idea of ‘morality’ is somewhat limited, if all it involves is straight tab A-slot B type intercourse.
I’d like to think that I have plenty of self-control — so much self-control, in fact, that at 27 I’m still waiting for true love to come show its face. The only ‘problem’, at least in your view of things, would be that this true love could be either male or female as far as I’m concerned. If your God thinks that two consenting adults being in love is immoral just because they share a gender, then your God, I’m sorry to say, is by definition a bigot.
‘He who is without sin’ may be spurious, but I like ‘judge not, lest ye be judged’.
Well said derren, and i must say that there has been so many good posts/ replys on here that not only should you be in power but you would have a hell of alot of great people supporting you. I think love is a great thing where ever you find it, as long as it does not hurt anyone. how many have died in the name of religion.
Ditto.
Well thought out and articulate blog article. I really find myself not having the patience to respond the way that you do without feeling like I want to lash out at the uninformed who cause more harm than good.
I have personal experience of this having become a “born again christian” at about the same time that I realised I was gay. The conflict and damage this caused lasted many years. I felt I would be eternally punished if I turned away from God and pursued my vile carnal desires. I sought counselling, had ministers pray over me to “rid me of the spirit of homosexuality” and would have done anything I could to be “cured”
Fortunately I have moved on and am now a happy humanist. However – I still feel anger about the misguided counsellings I was given by the christian chuch in my late teens
a cure for Homosexuality from both the liberal religious traditions and the that of Psychology. Allow me to state at the outset that I may indeed have found a real and workable cure. I choose to put this idea into the world not because I am greatly enamored of it but because I hope that if it is right, I may help to shape the message that such a cure sends. For too long the religious right has dominated any theological thought about a cure. This must change. What would happen if tomorrow a real cure was made by a group in the religious rights pocket such as NARTH? Imagine the fulcrum they would hold over what such a cure meant? I can here Jerry Falwell now.
– Recent research shows that people who believe homosexuality is a disease that needs to be cured are actually mentally ill. However we have found a cure for you now and can fix you. Here’s to hoping that you get better soon – Phillis
Religion is one of the worst things which could have happened to the humanity.It’s really hard to get rid of it unfortunately.
People are just too gullible and too afraid to face the reality.
Brainwashing just works too well
…i was always amazed by the crowds of fundamaentalists waving banners declaring:
‘GOD HATES FAGS!’
The massive irony, the phenomenal oxymoron, that is the meaning implicit in the first two words of this hypothesis, show such a lack of understanding of the most fundamental message embedded in all religious meaning, that i feel genuinely upset that these banner waving morons have so completely missed the point. To dedicate your life unswervingly to a God of compassion and love, and then to fail so spectacularly to understand what that God is saying, is truly heart breaking!
I pray for you. In my own way….
Lars – oh dear.
Oh dearie dearie me.
Where do I start?
Phillis puts it so well, no need to say anything…
ps Berber-Anna: how about Sally Morgan? People on this blog keep praising her, maybe she could be brood-mother and psychic queen…
A priest is named on this page accused of molesting a 28 year old man when he was 10. You may like to know that this good priest was cleared of the charges against him.
You people should stop worrying what Catholic or Evangelicals believe but what Islam believes, Sharia law includes the penalty of execution for homosexual acts, why not protest about that, the Catholics aren’t going to kill homosexuals, the Moslems already do and are coming to a country near you and probably sometime soon.
Steve: Personally, I worry about all fundamentalists equally, I don’t single out one sect in particular.
There’s enough Christian countries that have laws against homosexuality, with sentences up to and including life in prison. It’s awful that Saudi Arabia, Yemen, the United Arab Emirates and Iran feel the need to enact an age-old penal code and sentence homosexuals to death, and I strongly condemn this, but all fundamentalist monotheists are living their life according to a basic text (the Old Testament, present in Judaism, Christianity and Islam) that condemns homosexuality as sinful. The fact that most countries that currently execute homosexuals belong to one sect does not make the other sects harmless.
Nor, by the way, does it make moderate adherants to said sect more threatening.
god I want you
well said derren! u went REALLY deep there. i felt it. i absolutly agree with u. were all humans, arent we? if only some people could put ther differences aside…
I love Derren Brown, and i am upset that he is gay, but being gay is fine, I’m just upset that well, that I could never have you 😉 love you lots derren.
(Btw, Svengali was fricking awesome)
Wow , this is an amazing article . I am a lesbian and when I was only a teenager,I was told that being homosexual was a mental illness by my family . I went suicidal , but I took pride in being gay after years and I just wanted to say that you are amazing
It saddens me that religeon holds such a grudge against sexuality. It makes me beg to question that if we were created by a God to feel emotions such as love and lust, and then you feel ashamed and confused that a God has created you to have feelings for the opposite sex. I feel it just isn’t plausible. No intentions to offend.
well said derren, i am not upset that your gay because its none of my buisness and it doesnt effect the quality of your work which btw i love!!! cant wait to see you in svengali. ellie xxx
just realised that christians are a lot like hitler next they’ll be curing gingers and the irish.